Discussion in 'History' started by LionHearted, Mar 29, 2003.

  1. Pollux V Ra Bless America Registered Senior Member

    No, he killed six million Jews. Using your argument we can go as far as to say that every last organism on earth is in fact merely a prokaryote. His target was not race, it was religion. That he killed for no plausible reason is what makes him inherently evil and bad. To deny this makes you a Hitler supporter and, therefore, a disgrace to humanity.

    No, it is the truth. Find me one pro-Hitler site online that isn't obviously brimming with insanity.

    Although I doubt this story can be confirmed, one of the several routes for Hitler's hate of the Jewish people comes from his grandmother, I think, who worked for a wealthy Jew, and who was raped by the same wealthy Jew and became pregnant with one of Hitler's parents. Before or after WW1 he spent a great deal of his life on the streets, before he joined the Nazi party, and observed the epidemic of poverty covering Europe and most of the western world at the time. There are rich Jews and poor Jews, just like any other creed or religion. Hitler felt that they were either conniving politicians or inferior dredges of society.

    In the future, try to proofread your text. There IS information everywhere to disprove many of your points and many of the lies that conservative Americans believe wholeheartedly. Believe me--I tried at one website to persuade the conservatives there that they were wrong, with a slew of websites, and it did nothing. They choose not to believe.

    The same thing worked with Hitler. The man was an unbelievable public speaker, in fact, if America spoke German as its first language (which it almost did) then I don't doubt that we would have been on his side. Noam Chomsky mentioned in his Propaganda Model, I believe, that 80% of the world is a mob, and 20% of it is not. Hitler tricked the mob and killed or drove away the rest. It's not an altogether challenging thing to do IF you can speak like a god. And he did.

    If you can back up these claims with a shred of proof then I may consider believing them. However, like most of what you write, as of now they are no more than unsubstantiated generalizations.

    Complete and utter bullshit.

    gen·er·al·ize ( P ) Pronunciation Key (jnr--lz)
    v. gen·er·al·ized, gen·er·al·iz·ing, gen·er·al·iz·es
    v. tr.

    To reduce to a general form, class, or law.
    To render indefinite or unspecific.
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  3. Allahs_Mathematics Mar'Ifah Ahl As-Suffah Registered Senior Member

    What they are now depends on where u look , or do u wish to c it globally ? Im sorry but i find simply popular terms people use for themselves sad really , and the same goes for today's nazi- skinhead . Why should we redefine a ACTIVE subculture , with its own music (oi and skinhead reggae) because some germans and american are such amazing idiots , when they dress up like people who adore blacks and their culture ? If most of them dont know what traditional skiheads are (an active subculture as i mentioned) , it rather shows their stupidity than the need for redefining the word . An idiot already redefined it ...r u following him ? Im not

    So this is not just valuable for cultural or historical interpertations , but an understanding of what the meaning of a word is , instead of implying all sorts of things with it that have little to do with what it actually is .

    Thats not nitpicking , thats being correct .

    His target was religion ? Go read his book please ......

    first : no plausible reason he just woke up , thaught..hey , lets kill some jews ? Please stop drawing such simplistic conclusions . There were reasons , weither you agree with them or not .
    second ; howd u know who and what died ? history class ? LMAO
    third : an ethical debate on right and wrong , good and evil , we shouldnt have , since we wont agree .
    UC , i dont think it "bad" to kill people just for nothing , neither do i consider the person doing this "evil" .
    Such hopeless identifications i cant agree with .

    I cant believe my eyes here , do you actually judge a persons sanity on a FOLLOWERS site , something the person has NOTHING to do with . Ur logics are ....uhm , sad .

    I can make u one if u want , who isnt insane .
    U know , u probably didnt even check any site , u simply think the swastika as it is or a foto of hitler accounts for insanity , how sad and ignorant

    What ? LMAO

    Read his book for gods sakes

    he has one ball 2 right , i gues his nose was to big and people called him hey hooknose ashkenazi , i bet thats even where the word nazi came from .

    rich jews and por jews ? Im sorry , i dont feel like educating you on the Judaistic concept , culture and history , neither do i feel to inform you on their sociology . U better ask theazcowboy perhaps he wishes to educate u on the matter i dont

    Now why would i do such a useless thing ?

    conservative americans ?

    why do u speak about ur attempts to persuade conservatives ?
    how is this relevant ? who cares ?

    Yes he indeed was a great yeller , but whats THAT got to with it . Hitler was a madman and he tricked everybody ? Please , thats not how the world works mister .
    Many people , many nations , many motves , many resources and a lot of propaganda is involved , not JUST baseless propaganda .

    usnubstantial generalizations . Do i honesty have to tell you how jews invented anti-semitism.......or whas it a sad little , i dunno....saudi who didnt wanted to be discriminated against ?
    Please .....

    u didnt answer any question , no what do u do....u give me notes on how to pronounce generalize , LMAO .
    how do i reduce the fact that a jew ownes a or b , do i say ALL jews own a or b fact , i have even mentioned 90% or so not to have any consciously contributing part in it even .
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  5. spookz Banned Banned


    good argument.
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  7. fredx Banned Banned

    i have some ideas about this...

    Allahs Mathematics, it is so clearly that you don't like Jews, that you should really try to come to terms with your own hate before polluting the air waves with your thought bombs.

    Everybody thinks the world has changed so much these days but we still have people like you that blame the Jews because your life isn't going your way.

    Jews are successful business men and entertainers, they are smart and they go out and make it happen, deal with it. Does that neccessarily mean their evil, no. Does that mean they are responsible for everything wrong in the world because they may be seen by you as greedy or too successful, no.

    I also think you don't give enough credit to the Isrealis, who in my opinion probably show alot of temperence in terms of what they could do and what they actually do to Palistinians.

    As for your generalizations, I don't think you listened to Xev. The Jews were not known for having their own political structures in pre-Nazi Germany and probably don't command the most political power of any group in the US, but things are however changing.

    So not all of your generalizations are the "gospel" like you think they are. However, I don't have the time to dispute everything you are saying.

    As to the rest of the crew here, generalizations can be useful and can have value as long as they contain some measure of truth and actually represent to some extent reality. Generalization is a tool to think about things. Both Hannah Arendt and Freidrich Nietzsche made generalizations and nobody here says they don't know what they are talking about. Generalizations may in fact be the basis for good sociology. Maybe, you want to knock down what people have to say by always calling "generalization!" but I think it is indicative of the mindlessness of our society that you can no longer make a generalization, provided of course that it does have some verifiable truth to it. Generalization still may be seen as dealing with abstraction but also it still has some positive value to help us think and understand things.
  8. Allahs_Mathematics Mar'Ifah Ahl As-Suffah Registered Senior Member

    Fredx ,

    I will only respond to a few thing whitch u might not even coprehend .

    1)I might be a jew
    2)I might be very wealthy Jew as well

    Criticizing a certain group does not exclude me from the group mister . And please......i bitch on jews cuz my life aint great ?
    LMAO . I bet thats what the slavedraver said to the slave couple years ago too . "hey man , ur just JEALOUS"..get over it , start picking that damn cotton .

    One thing u say is interesting though , u refer to Xev saying they didnt have any power . According to Hitler (and thats the whole point in this damn discussion ) they ran the Social Democrats and the press in Austria (mein Kampf)
    Id say thats powerfull (in AUSTRIA) . Weither Hitler was lying or telling the truth on this subject , is beyond my knowledge . Perhaps that is what Xev refers at , assuming he himself has read the book since he referred to it earlier on .

    And if u wish to quarrel with me on weither the Jews are being nice in Palestine , i have no wish or time to educate u , talk to The AZCowboy or Helen , they know alot about the subject and they seem willingly to share their information with those who obviously have not even the slightest clue , or the slightest care .

    Just 1 thing to say about that : COLONIZATION
  9. Pollux V Ra Bless America Registered Senior Member

    These reasons were baseless. To me, they were not plausible.

    I have better things to do.

    How do you know? To tell you the truth, I know nothing. All I do know comes from history books, from history class, etc. I wasn't there. Neither were you. This particular argument serves no purpose because it leaves us both in the same place.

    Then perhaps you should join the military.

    Unlike yours, which are nonexistent?

    I believe, for the most part, that I am not insane.

    Did YOU even read the book? Jesus christ, Hitler didn't create the Nazi party you moron!

    I doubt it would make sense to me or any other reasonably sane person anyway.

    Yes it is. I don't know if you've checked, but we do have a lot of crazy people running the world. It's almost always been that way. If you can't make a great speech, then you can't rally the moderates to your side. Hitler could brainwash anyone.

    All propaganda is baseless. That's why they call it propaganda.

    Yes, but again, you have absolutely no basis for saying such things. I don't know where you learned them, actually. Maybe through "that book written by that Nazi guy who killed everyone." Yes, a perfectly legitimate source to base our outlook on life, wouldn't you say?
  10. Whyatt Thrash Indecent Registered Senior Member

    In Sweden, if you're a skinhead (shaved head, tattoos, "bomber" jacket, folded-up jeans and Dr. Marten's), you most likely are a nazi or at least a racist. Or pretending to be a nazi to tick people off. That's just the skinhead subculture over here.

    So in sweden, "skinhead"=nazi. So you can't just brush of the subculture over here with "that's not how it started", or "that's not the way it works over here" because a culture is only relevant in its context, right?
  11. Allahs_Mathematics Mar'Ifah Ahl As-Suffah Registered Senior Member

    First of all , we dont only speak of how it started , but how it still IS (although in a great minority) .
    Secondly , and much more important , it is ridiciouless to adapt a definiton of something because OTHER people now claim the word being defined .

    What if all neo-nazi's start wearing gallabia's and beards and turbans , and start calling themselves Taliban ...... do we then forget about the Taliban themselves and start calling the neonazi's Taliban , just cuz thats how they dress nowadays ?
    Or maybe they start dressing in complete military outfits and want to be called we do that ?

    and about sweden ......who r these guys then ?

    its ridiciouless

    stop it
  12. Allahs_Mathematics Mar'Ifah Ahl As-Suffah Registered Senior Member

    WHY ?

    Stop talking about his reasons if u refuse to actually read about his reasons

    I dont either , hey i wasnt the one throwing around who killed what and when .
    I simply create knowledge from logical deductions on premises .
    but weither the premises are false or true , both of us dont know .
    I can tell u that western history/books classes are extremely biased/incomplete/hilarious , so if u go by them just like that , u'll end up making ignorant remarks like u'r do .

    cant turn the ignorance off can u ?
    perhaps some ethical studies would help , perhaps some logic too.

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    Give this man/woman an award for giving the most ignorant reply of the day .

    50 years later and this is the it might happen all over again and still u wouldnt learn ANYTHING from it .
    please ....this discussion is getting sad , just really sad

    whoohoo logic is re-discovered

    Do u honestly believe i base my views on an idiot like hitler ?
    oh.......u probably think he was pretty smart tricking all those other idiots . Those people trick THEMSELVES on a daily basis , just like u do .

    Again , not one question is answered , just dumbass remarks are made .
  13. Whyatt Thrash Indecent Registered Senior Member

    It's really irrelevant. Over here, "skinhead" is connected to the subculture of neo-nazis. Whether some other cultural group "owned" it first doesn't matter, cause they have it now too.

    It's like the word "gay". You can't say "I'm gay" anymore and be interpreted as anything else than being homosexual. That word has become besieged by a subculture. Too bad for the ppl who originally "owned" the word and to them meant something else, but that's the way it is.

    Plus, there's a natural connection between, well, people who have skinned heads and are called skinheads. Maybe the name came from this natural connection. Maybe the word came from a misunderstanding, someone who misinterpreted the meaning of the subculture and attached it to these new neo-nazis.

    If the Taliban's called themselves "turbans" it might be the same thing. And people around here started wearing turbans belonging to another subculture. "Look, here comes those turbans again". Over here, it just comes natural..

    But that's irrelevant too, since the word now (obviously) DOES belong to both subcultures there's no need debating whether or not it SHOULD. It just DOES. I understand this comes as a discomfort for people around the world who call themselves skinheads and are NOT neo-nazis, but that's the way it is. They're just gonna have to explain, over and over again to people that no, they're not connected to any right-wing movement and no, they don't hate people that come from other countries. But that's just life.

    I have to explain every time I meet a "vanilla" person that I am not a hard-rocker, and i am not a hippie just because I have long hair. Just because that attribute has been widely and popularly sieged by those cultures. Sure, it can be a bitch when people realize that my musical taste does not limit itself to Danzig and Soundgarden, and a whole lot other misconceptions that people sterotypically attribute to my conceived subculture.. But that's justl ife, m8...

    I'm just gonna stop rambling now.

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  14. ben nevis Registered Senior Member

    Peace brothers. This is now and raking over the coals does nothing but unleash genetic disdain. We should be looking at a future where there are no bounderies or sectarianism because of a man's creed or colour.

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